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Laurie
Double Platinum Member
    
Canada
4854 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2008 : 01:21:17
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Folks - is this in the public domain? (like the DS-1 seeing eye mod?) If so, does someone have it that they can post or send?
This will be my last attempt to wrestle my modded MT-2 into something I like long-term. I heard some good reports about it from a friend today.
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Edited by - Laurie on 07/06/2008 01:22:55 |
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zentropa
Gold Member
  
USA
837 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2008 : 03:14:02
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did about 4 hours worth of digging and didn't find any info on it aside from the clarity mods.
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Laurie
Double Platinum Member
    
Canada
4854 Posts |
Posted - 07/06/2008 : 06:55:40
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quote: Originally posted by zentropa
did about 4 hours worth of digging and didn't find any info on it aside from the clarity mods.
THanks for trying! Appreciate it! |
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jack
Platinum Member
   
USA
1418 Posts |
Posted - 07/08/2008 : 02:45:07
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I own 2 Keeley modded MT-2s because I cannot afford a Matamp, and I can get those sounds, or something close enough to it, from these. I don't know how accurate this is, but I found this on another forum:
quote: http://music-electronics-forum.com/showthread.php?t=5052
I have no knowledge of what the "Twilight Zone" mod is or actually does. The boastful ad copy is no better or worse than just about any other. A quick trip to pedalgeek or Musictoyz will confirm that. I took a look at the manual for the mods over at Bob Keeley's site, and while there is more to it than I presume, I think I can suss out what the essentials are.
First off, the stock unit does its clipping with a pair of 1N4148 diodes. They set a limit on how hot the output signal can ultimately be. If they are added to with extra diodes, or replaced with diodes that have a higher forward voltage, you will achieve a noticeably greater overall maximum output level. This sort of change/outcome is common to every distortion circuit that uses diodes for clipping. It does not change the behaviour of the tone controls or anything else. It simply raises the ceiling so that if the signal wants to stand a little taller, it can.
If you add a diode to only ONE half of the clipping section, you get something that many folks (Keeley included) will refer to as asymmetrical clipping. I have publically expressed doubts about this before, since I feel that the asymmetry is a function of several other things being lined up at the same time, but it is clear and not a misrepresentation at all that such a change produces a slightly different quality of distortion and does permita slightly more dynamic feel, not to mention more output (though NOT more gain; those two things are different).
I have no idea where the cap and resistor substitutions are so we'll ignore them. In high-gain devices it IS useful to lower the noise floor on the input section, but if you can tolerate the current level of noise in your pedal, this to-be-suggested change will not make it any worse. To accomplish the essentials of the mod, locate a point on the board where you see two small glass diodes lying beside each other, end-to-end. That is one will have a stripe in one end, and the 2nd one will have a stripe at the opposite end. Unsolder one end of one of the diodes, and gently lift it up on the component side of the board so that it is standing at sort of a 45-degree angle. It doesn't really matter which diode or which end.
Find either a 1N418, or a 1N914, or perhaps even a 1N34 at Radio Shack or wherever. The 4148 or 914 will result in more change in level. Solder one end of the additional diode to where the lifted-up lead used to go. Make absolutely sure that the orientation is correct. What is "correct"? Well, if the original end you unsoldered had the stripe, then you should solder in the extra diode with the stripe at that end. If the original unsoldered end was non-stripe, then that's what goes there. With the extra diode added, snip the lead off, and solder the two free ends of the standing diodes together, making sure not to overheat the joint too much.
That's it. Package her up, and rock.
The Keeley way of doing this provides a toggle switch to select between stock and mod. That's part of the reason why the mod costs more than my simple description would suggest. They do the machining, and make sure they have a decent switch that will fit the available space without shorting out anything. In Boss pedals, such switch installation does require precision, and that's what you're paying for. Since the extra diode will provide a sound you won't dislike, and since you know how to reverse the mod, we'll leave it at that and ignore the switch. If you hate it you can always remove it.
One other thing you can do to make the unit a little more deadly is to add more gain. If you trace the path of the Gain control (a 200k pot), one end of it goes to a 1k resistor. Replace that 1k resistor with another resistor, anywhere from say 39k to 68k, whatever you have on hand. That will raise the gain of that stage from 202x to 270x (if you use a 68k resistor).
Also, Monte Allums has 3 different mod kits for the MT-2...the Keeley modded MT-2 contains a 3 way switch...so maybe their mods are similar? I haven't had any experience with any of Monte Allums pedals or mods, but I hear lots of good things about them. Here's some info and soundclips of the Monte Allums mods: http://www.monteallums.com/pedal_mods.html#bossmt2
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Von
Copper Member
Australia
26 Posts |
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Laurie
Double Platinum Member
    
Canada
4854 Posts |
Posted - 07/16/2008 : 15:06:55
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Well... I put in a mod that I think similar to the "JCM Boogie" mod. LED + 1N4004 for the diodes plus increased C36 to 1�F. Also removed C25 and C35. Still not what i'm looking for.
Here is a question... One of the things I did to this pedal is replace all the 1�F electros with polyester, and the 10�F electros with tantalum. I read somewhere that leaving the old electros in keeps the pedal a bit dark and it actually sounds better? What do you think? |
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Von
Copper Member
Australia
26 Posts |
Posted - 07/17/2008 : 21:26:51
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| I never replace the 10uf...........replacing the 1uf is good just make sure that you're using metal film poly......and watch the size of those things other wise you won't get the pcb back into the pedal. |
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Laurie
Double Platinum Member
    
Canada
4854 Posts |
Posted - 07/18/2008 : 03:02:53
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| Thanks Von! |
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MoonWatcher
Bronze Member

USA
98 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 05:46:08
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quote: Originally posted by jack
Also, Monte Allums has 3 different mod kits for the MT-2...the Keeley modded MT-2 contains a 3 way switch...so maybe their mods are similar? I haven't had any experience with any of Monte Allums pedals or mods, but I hear lots of good things about them.
I was very underwhelmed with the M.A. MT-2 mod...
My biggest prob with the MT-2 is despite the extra op amp stages, I still can't get it to sound as good as a tweaked Dano Fab Tone. The dual notch in both peds is nearly identical. The mid booster in the FT is fixed, but easily tweaked if you don't like it where it is. Even if I decrease the stock .33 uF bass cap on the FT, it still has more bass than the MT-2.
I think that I just don't like the Mitsubishi chips in Boss peds that use them. The Fab Tone has 4558's - that could be why I like it better. My tweaked FT's tend to sound like Cowboys From Hell on steroids. Very tight, excellent chunk, and way quieter than the MT-2. The only ped I've ever modded that sounds excellent with dropped tunings. If I could reverse engineer a MT-2 into one I would, because I don't like the Dano PCB or pots.
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Edited by - MoonWatcher on 08/04/2008 05:47:55 |
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MoonWatcher
Bronze Member

USA
98 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2008 : 18:04:30
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quote: Originally posted by Laurie
Well... I put in a mod that I think similar to the "JCM Boogie" mod. LED + 1N4004 for the diodes plus increased C36 to 1�F. Also removed C25 and C35. Still not what i'm looking for.
Here is a question... One of the things I did to this pedal is replace all the 1�F electros with polyester, and the 10�F electros with tantalum. I read somewhere that leaving the old electros in keeps the pedal a bit dark and it actually sounds better? What do you think?
Actually, I generally don't like tants in the higher gain stuff at all. MF are fine if they'll fit, but I've had equally good success just going to a nonpolar e-lytics. I don't touch the 10 uF caps, either. They are fine as is, IMO.
I think I found the sweet spot for C36 - .068 uF. Anything higher and you just don't have as much of a usable range, IMO.
I think I've also discovered what will really smooth out the top end - any bright cap in the feedback loops that is less than 100 pF needs to be bumped up - the 10 pF caps really have to go, IMO. Everyone forgets about those little caps, it seems. If you address them, it makes most any chip or diode combination work well, IMO. |
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slideman
Copper Member
26 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2008 : 16:43:36
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You would be really happy with the Monte Allums/CMATmods for the MT-2 -- you can buy the mods directly from him and do it yourself -- the Sustaniac mod single handedly give you a warmed and stacked lead tone -- think Gilmour. The pedal also has some fat heavy metal tones as well. I use it as a one-trick pony -- I step on it for my Gilmour/PF lead tone.
http://www.monteallums.com/
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Laurie
Double Platinum Member
    
Canada
4854 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2008 : 17:18:33
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Still fiddling with my "sandpit" MT-2. Have replaced the 47pF caps with 150pF caps, the 10pF caps with 100pF caps. Put the 10�F caps back to the old electros (swapped the tants back out). Diodes set to 1N4148 and 2x1N4148 in series (assymetrical).
Sounding OK now... waiting on some MOSFETs to check how they sound.
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MoonWatcher
Bronze Member

USA
98 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2008 : 21:08:14
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Let me know how the mos's work in it - I've gotten sidetracked from putting them in mine.
Actually, for Gilmour, I tend to use a Muff that's pretty similar to his Ram's Head.
The Sustainia mod is the M.A. one that I've got - I was very underwhelmed. YMMV. Putting 1N34A's in that circuit is not the way to go, IMO. Also, Allums seems to neglect addressing C36, at all.
IMO, The MT-2 has so much gain that you can drop a bunch of it and still have plenty. I actually bias the prime gain stage with a 4.7K resistor vs. the stock 1K - lots of folks will cut this sucker down to 470 or less, but I don't think that's the way to go.
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MoonWatcher
Bronze Member

USA
98 Posts |
Posted - 08/08/2008 : 23:14:15
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Got around to trying a pair of 2N700's - something went afoul...
I lost about 60% of the drive, and it was notching out the freq. spectrum all over the place...sounded like big phase cancellation holes.
I must've shorted something out - I'll have to try it again with a fresh pair of mos's. Alternatively, I might try it w/a mos and a 1N4148.
I think that I've also got to nix those Allums tants. I'm just not a big fan of those little polarized wonders, I guess. |
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Laurie
Double Platinum Member
    
Canada
4854 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2008 : 00:23:44
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Just put some NTE491 MOSFET clippers (functional equivalent of 2N7000) in my sandpit MT-2. Sounds good so far (can't crank it yet becuse my wife has Clients). Will let you know how it really sounds cranked when I can.
Interestingly, opening up the MT-2 like the mods on mine have done takes it somewhere near an XT-2.
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Edited by - Laurie on 08/09/2008 00:24:17 |
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MoonWatcher
Bronze Member

USA
98 Posts |
Posted - 08/09/2008 : 02:23:26
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Well, my eyes must be going up. 
Apparently, I didn't tie together the G & D on one of my 2N700's. I'll plop it in tomorrow.
The XT-2, huh? It uses a pair of LED's with a biggish .033 uF bypassing them, IIRC... |
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