| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
visserman
Platinum Member
1072 Posts |
 Posted - 12/27/2008 : 14:30:06
|
A few weeks ago I wanted to test a few of my phaserpedals. Some of them are batt. powered. I did put batteries in all of them and came back to play them a few weeks later. On one pedal [Ibazen Phase Tone] the batt. was completely dead. It surprised me a bit as I had not used the pedal at all. Seems that pedal drains the batt. even when pedal is left unused.
Why is this possible? Is it due to a fault? The pedal sounds fantastic when batt. is full.
I had a old MXR pedal dist. + which had a similar problem.
Is there anything I can do about this? apart from the obvious, which is to remove batt. when you do not use the pedal.
Could it be that older pedals do have this problem? It is common sense to remove batt. when pedals are not use for a long time to prevent your batteries from leaking.
Anyone any thoughts on what could be the issue here?
Cheers!!
|
|
|
Håkon
Copper Member
Norway
12 Posts |
Posted - 12/27/2008 : 20:51:01
|
| i don't know about ibanez or mxr pedals, but boss pedals stay on when a cable is connected to the input. so if you leave the pedals connected the battery will drain out. maybe this is whats happened. |
 |
|
|
DeFrag
Moderator
USA
3409 Posts |
Posted - 12/27/2008 : 21:57:29
|
Its a form of parasitic loading. The interaction between components at potential inherently cause trace currents to drain the battery.
Håkon is also correct, if a pedal is powered by the input jack, the battery will drain post-haste.
BTW, welcome to Bossarea Håkon!  |
|
|
|
zerksies
Double Platinum Member
USA
3406 Posts |
Posted - 12/27/2008 : 22:52:22
|
| i agree completely |
|
|
|
visserman
Platinum Member
1072 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2008 : 17:16:59
|
Thanks for your comments but none of you seem to have sussed it.
It is a mystery to me as well how this happens. Needless to say that I leave the jackplug out of the pedal when I do not plan to play. |
|
|
|
Laurie
Double Platinum Member
Canada
4854 Posts |
Posted - 12/30/2008 : 17:52:14
|
In Boss pedals, the battery is physically switched out of the circuit when there is no plug in the jack. The battery then only has the normal "shelf-life" gradual degradation.
Can't say how other pedals do it... |
|
|
|
visserman
Platinum Member
1072 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2009 : 13:47:59
|
I know guys,
It seem that this pedal just drains battery even when you not play, and it will drain it in space of about a few days, maybe even just one day. How is that possible? I guess someone has changed something internally and this may have an effect on batterylife.
I was wondering what this could be but no one, so far, seem to be able to think of what could be the culprit.
AS mentioned before, I used to have a MXR dist. + and this one was modified, pedal had similar problem.
Not sure if anyone has made any changes to the Phasetone apart from renewed the wires which run from batt. clip
|
|
|
|
Dr. Bob
Moderator
Australia
6593 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2009 : 15:54:57
|
Hi visserman & guys
Just a bit of a heads up, on this issue.
I have worked on a few pedals, and it seems that on the older pedals,
they sometimes used the output jack as the on/off switch.
Instead of using the input socket,
like they do in all the Boss pedals, and in 99.99% of all the current other brands.
Just that they decided to use the output socket, as the negative to ground, on/off switch.
Most notably was a bunch of Shin-ei wah's and some other vintage stuff from that era.
The one I rebuild a few years ago for Rod (ShakeTheDevil), WAS, like that, but I wired it as per current convention/s.
Although this might not be the case in visserman's situation.
It's just something else to keep in mind, & in fact it nearly escaped me until this evening, when I was re-reading this thread.
And as visserman states, someone may have done some modifications to the pedals he owns.
Regards Dr. Bob
|
|
|
|
Dr. Bob
Moderator
Australia
6593 Posts |
Posted - 01/02/2009 : 15:59:57
|
Hey visserman
I was just thinking:
If you have access to a multimeter, set it to the mA current settings.
and unsnap one side of the battery snap, & put the meter in series with the unconnected/unsnapped connections of the battery.
And measure to see if there is any current being drawn by the pedal in the supposedly off position.
Regards Dr. Bob |
|
|
|
Disco Stu
Silver Member
USA
303 Posts |
Posted - 01/03/2009 : 00:25:58
|
A friend has an old MXR distortion plus, and it siphons juice out of the battery if the stomp switch is left "on", regardless if cables are left plugged in.
There is no LED so one has to be extra careful to make sure that it's "off" before quitting. |
|
|
|
visserman
Platinum Member
1072 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2009 : 17:43:33
|
quote:
Originally posted by Disco Stu
A friend has an old MXR distortion plus, and it siphons juice out of the battery if the stomp switch is left "on", regardless if cables are left plugged in.
There is no LED so one has to be extra careful to make sure that it's "off" before quitting.
That is an interesting comment, I always make sure that pedals are in the off postition when I do not use pedal, but still, intersting observation!!
Thanks!! |
|
|
|
visserman
Platinum Member
1072 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2009 : 17:49:51
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Bob
Hey visserman
I was just thinking:
If you have access to a multimeter, set it to the mA current settings.
and unsnap one side of the battery snap, & put the meter in series with the unconnected/unsnapped connections of the battery.
And measure to see if there is any current being drawn by the pedal in the supposedly off position.
Regards Dr. Bob
That is a good tip Bob, unfortunately no multimeter here.
Could it be that when people do mods, that they make mistakes in the department as you described before? I have a feeling something has been swapped around, like a postive or negative polarity or something of that nature. Nothing which has an impact on the sound, but more on the state of drawing juice from a batt.
Talking about batteries: I have quite a few 9 volt batteries from pedals I bought new. I take the batt. out and store them, some have dates of 2004, but when I measure their strength they are still full. Batt. techn. has come a long way, and it seems that you can keep them for quite a while.
On the whole I use AC adaptors for any playing situation, but then I have the odd few pedal which does not have a AC socket, and it is in cases like this one that I discover these odd little problems. |
|
|
|
DeFrag
Moderator
USA
3409 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2009 : 18:48:37
|
A component doesn't have to be an LED to "draw" current.
If you have a closed circuit of any kind a battery will drain faster than a battery laying in its new packaging. Its called entropy folks & there's no getting around it.
I believe that certain combinations of circuit components interact with each other in a certain way as to suck juice from batteries more so than differently configured circuits. Maybe its inductors, maybe its RLC, whatever.
I've read that if you have a simple loop of wire in a studio, it will pickup the 50/60Hz & an induced voltage will be present. Turn on a florescent light around a pedal & don't think a few million electrons won't jump state.  |
|
|
|
Laurie
Double Platinum Member
Canada
4854 Posts |
Posted - 01/05/2009 : 19:04:41
|
Defrag, everything you say is 100% true. I don't mean to start an "animated discussion" here () but I do need to add the caveat that it is true only when there is a complete circuit.
A piece of wire will pick up 60Hz, but it only matters if "the switch is closed" and it is connected to something. If the signal path is not complete (e.g. no plug in the input jack of a Boss pedal) then even if the electrons jiggle about because of ambient EM fields, they can't actually go anywhere.
If the electrons can't "go anywhere", then the chemical reaction in the battery will not proceed, and the battery will not go flat. Well, strictly speaking, the leakage current in the battery will give a miniscule drive to the chemical reaction resulting in what we call "shelf life".
I can state definitively that there is no way a battery can be drained faster than the leakage current/shelf life (a couple of years typically) unless there is a closed circuit somewhere.
Something, somewhere in the circuit must still have power applied to it somehow for the battery to drain. Hence Dr. Bob's suggestion of a multi-meter to see if something is drawing current.
|
Edited by - Laurie on 01/05/2009 19:27:10 |
|
|
|
DeFrag
Moderator
USA
3409 Posts |
Posted - 01/06/2009 : 01:38:14
|
| Good clarification points Laurie. |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
Battery Drainage When Batt is left in pedal.
