| Author |
 Topic  |
|
DarrinPA
Silver Member
USA
221 Posts |
 Posted - 06/04/2007 : 22:08:13
|
| I have raised the bridge as much as I can and am still getting a buzzing around the 4th and 5th frets on all the strings. Does anybody have any advice or can point me in the right direction of what I should do? Is this something the truss rod can fix? |
|
|
FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2007 : 22:53:37
|
my experience is limited when it comes to truss rods...what sort of guitar is it ....?..bolt on or glued in neck....i would be very careful messing with truss rods especially if its a old or vintage guitar and especially if its a les paul or similar type of guitar,a mistake could be very costly or even impossible to fix correctly.....i had a problem with the neck on my orginal yamaha sg 2000s and i like to meddle with most of my gear but in this instance i brought it to a luthier to get it ajusted....humidity can play a part also,do you leave the guitar leaning by the neck against things...?if its an old cheapo that you want to experiment on,the truss rod is concave so you could try turning it a quarter turn to see if it makes a difference,also if the guitar took a knock or a fall the tension on the truss rod might have loosened a bit so maybe it needs to be tightened but if its a guitar you love be careful....... |
 |
|
|
Pedalhead
Silver Member
USA
245 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2007 : 23:09:20
|
| I take all my guitars to the pros. Find your local guitar tech. |
|
|
|
DarrinPA
Silver Member
USA
221 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2007 : 00:50:32
|
It's a cheap guitar, First Act is the brand. I could careless about it, I would prefer not to break it but I am willing to risk messing it up.
It's a bolt on neck.
Leans on it's neck?...all the time.
Goes through very drastic climate changes twice a week.
Has recently and repetitively been dropped, thrown, kicked...
I'm not willing to pay to get it fixed because it wouldn't be worth it. Plus the guitar tech at SamAsh messed up my perfectly working strat and then lost it for a few hours. I'd rather risk doing this myself.
|
|
|
|
cyberpunk409
Bronze Member
Australia
56 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2007 : 02:26:36
|
has the buzzing around the 4th and 5th frets always been there, or has it just occured?
if it's always been there, chances are the 6th fret wire (and possibly all following it) is too high, OR, the 4th and 5th fret wires are too low. might not be worth fixing on a cheap axe.
if it's just recently occurred, you probably need to adjust your neck. other than adjusting your truss rod, you can take the neck off and place a shim of some sort in the neck pocket. A small strip of business-card-thick cardboard placed towards the neck pickup might help in this case.
Other than BRUTALLY FORCING the truss rod to turn, any changes you make should be reversible... have fun experimenting. |
|
|
|
DeFrag
Moderator
USA
3409 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2007 : 03:36:20
|
| Most people put thinner strings on erroneously thinking they won't buzz on the frets. If the action, saddle, & intonation is all setup correctly & there isn't undue wear on the frets or nut, I'd recommend trying a set of strings about a size larger than what you're running. They'll actually sit a shave higher the fretboard than thinner strings. Worth a shot if you've expended all else & your nut doesn't need replaced. |
|
|
|
fragsie
Copper Member
United Kingdom
31 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2007 : 03:40:04
|
I agree - also check to see if there is a pronounced kink in the neck by looking down from nut to bridge. If you see a curve outwards towards the strings then the rod is the way to go.
If it wont budge try clamping the neck on the fret side to a straight edge overnight - slacken off the truss rod first - this will put tension on the wood and rod and ease the adjustment.
Just remember that truss rods are pretty thin and are easy broken - also the amount you have to move it to make a difference is very small - usually less than half a turn from the nut hitting the neck pocket. mark the rod and part of the pocket with a pen/pencil as a ground zero position - if you get lost you can always go back there and live with the buzz !!!!!
hope this helps you out. |
Edited by - fragsie on 06/05/2007 03:41:22 |
|
|
|
mattoqua
Silver Member
Canada
438 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2007 : 07:48:53
|
What style of guitar is it?
If its like a les paul, id say raise the tune-o-matic a little, if its a strat style, raise the intonation a little.
Or you can just deepen the pickups a little. There should be 2 screws next to each pickup. Just turn them to the right to lower the pickup. Try to keep them the highest possible with no buzz.
Hope that helps! |
|
|
|
StratoSphere
Double Platinum Member
Canada
2232 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 00:30:54
|
in my experience, if the truss rod is too "loose" it will bow on you but the deepest part of the bow usually occurs around the 9-14th frets. you said yours is buzzing on the 4th and 5th which to me sounds like an odd place for your strings to be buzzing..
heres what i think is happening....
i think if you had your bridge set at about medium height, your strings would buzz around 12th fret. but since you raised the bridge height, that raised the strings on the "bridge-end" of your guitar which gave clearance to the frets closer to the bridge. but since you didnt raise the nut, the strings are still sitting low on the "headstock-end" of your axe which is probably causing the buzzing at such an odd place on your fretboard.
if you decide to adjust it yourself, keep these tips in mind.
-first take a real close look at the frets and make sure its not a sunken/loose fret. also look at the neck from all angles. if its your truss rod, you might actually be able to see a bow.
-try to find out what kind of truss rod you have. there are 1 piece rods, 2 piece rods and possibly more.
-tune your guitar down before working on it to relieve string tension.
-you might find that actually removing your D and G strings easier than working around them if you have the kind that requires an allen key in the middle of the headstock
-its probably not going to turn easy, in fact, youre going to have to push hard, but dont overdue it. worried yet???
-you might hear a slight creaking noise, but like i said, as long as you take it easy, it should be alright.
if you adjust it and it still buzzes, i recommend replacing your nut with a higher set one. like i said before, i think it will stop your buzzing if you match the bridge height with a high nut. but keep in mind that if you have to resort to this, your neck is probably still bowed and it might throw you off with a mix of high/low action in different areas.
and if worse comes to worse and youre really screwed, i recommend looking into shims.
the pros recommend to only adjust 1/8 of a turn at a time and let it sit overnight to let everything adjust properly. usually guitar
recommendations are overprecautios and i did 1/2 turn on mine per day, but remember that youre actually changing the shape of your necks wood. plus overdoing it can actually result in backbow.
i had a friend in college that had a bass with a huge bow. he mustve taken the truss rod out.. the neck looked like a banana. he could still rock it pretty good though.
good luck
|
Edited by - StratoSphere on 06/06/2007 00:35:10 |
|
|
|
DarrinPA
Silver Member
USA
221 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 01:44:12
|
Thank you all for the info and sorry about making everybody guess about this. Other helpful info;
*Strat style bridge
*The nut does seem low
*Looking down the fret board it actually looks like the 7th fret is funky even though the 4th is the main trouble.
*truss rod access is in the headstock
*Just received the guitar a few weeks ago, but I'm sure the buzzing was there before
I was thinking of useing the shim idea but if that puts the neck at an angle wouldn't the problem be worse? I have no problem put higher guage strings on it, I've always wanted to step up to a set of 10-52. Should I tighten the truss rod? or loosen it?
I was thinking about holding the neck over a fire, just like when you hold out a tree branch over fire it bends it. I was thinking of useing that to my advantage. Jus incase anybody wants to see what it looks like I'll put a link below, I didn't take the pics but they good shots. Notice that there isn't anyway of getting to the volume and tone knobs? There isn't an opening to the inside.
http://acapella.harmony-central.com/showthread.php?t=1354140 |
|
|
|
StratoSphere
Double Platinum Member
Canada
2232 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 02:20:12
|
hey DarrinPA. just a quick note about the shim. since you already raised the bridge so much i doubt that a shim would fix anything. even if you put in a large shim, it would boost the frets closest to the bridge but i dont think it would do much for the 4th/5th frets. This would make the offset even greater. like i said it sounds like you have to counter the heightened bridge with a higher nut. but before even messing with that i would try adjusting the truss rod first. this way, you can get yourself a dead straight neck, and then bring the bridge back down to regular height, not to mention having better action.
and about holding the neck over fire. i cant see that being healthy for anything. at the least it could leave burn marks, or even warp your neck, lose frets etc. or worse remember that a truss rod is a steel bar inside the neck. i doubt heating it would allow you to bend the bar, and even if so, it would reset back to where it was since the truss rod has to be turned to be adjusted. picture it like a giant screw and the more you tighten it, the the more it bows/unbows.
i just opened the link. thats a pretty nice guitar |
Edited by - StratoSphere on 06/06/2007 02:24:11 |
|
|
|
DarrinPA
Silver Member
USA
221 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 03:52:18
|
I'll try adjusting the truss rod first, if that doesn't help maybe I can buy a new nut. They are really cheap on Warmoth.com but the files are expensive [they aren't pre cut]. Does any body know where I can buy a pre cut nut? Or could I possibly rip off the nut that's on the guitar now put something under it to raise it and just glue all that down?
If it turns our that a fret is too high can I hammer it in deeper? This guitar is only $60 so I just want it to work correctly without putting more than a few dollars of parts on/in it. I guess the fire idea is not going to work, oh well. |
|
|
|
mattoqua
Silver Member
Canada
438 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 03:57:32
|
hey
that is a really nice guitar. Don't put it in/over the fire 
If the whole neck is bending, then I would say that you should go into the truss rod. I didnt think you would want to do any big changes, but I think raising the nut a little would fix it fully. Maybe you could file down the frets a little and make them all even (if they arent) as well. Putting a shim in the neck pocket would help as well, since if you raise the nut a little, you can shim the neck backwards a bit and it will lower the action around the 15-24 frets to get it back to how it was before. (so only the first 1-7 frets get raised). Some people say it even gets easier to play the more angle it has, since the neck is coming more towards you.
And about the control knobs, maybe theres an openable side panel to get into them? |
|
|
|
mattoqua
Silver Member
Canada
438 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 04:02:34
|
quote:
Originally posted by DarrinPA
I'll try adjusting the truss rod first, if that doesn't help maybe I can buy a new nut. They are really cheap on Warmoth.com but the files are expensive [they aren't pre cut]. Does any body know where I can buy a pre cut nut? Or could I possibly rip off the nut that's on the guitar now put something under it to raise it and just glue all that down?
If it turns our that a fret is too high can I hammer it in deeper? This guitar is only $60 so I just want it to work correctly without putting more than a few dollars of parts on/in it. I guess the fire idea is not going to work, oh well.
hey you snuck that post in before i was done typing 
You can just put a piece of wood under the nut and glue it in there, or you could buy a new pre-cut nut, but theyre expensive (my guitar shop wanted $80 to cut it  ), so I suggest just do it yourself by raising it.
You cant really hammer them in deeper, but with a fret-file, you can file it down shorter which could solve your problem |
|
|
|
DarrinPA
Silver Member
USA
221 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 04:19:26
|
I have a 1987 USA Ibanez that has been shim'd and most people like playing it because of that slight angle, I don't care either way. I'll probably shim it if I raise the nut. Would a string retainer/ string tree help?
And no there isn't any side or back panel to get into the guitar, I'd just have to cut open the back and create a control plate for it. I bought this so I could mess around with and that really stopped me form doing anything with this guitar. I wanted to see how it wired up because it has seperate volume controls but no switch so it's like a jazz bass set up which is really cool because I can roll back one volume without decreaseing the overall volume.
Is there no edit function on this board? |
|
|
|
mattoqua
Silver Member
Canada
438 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 05:34:48
|
a string retainer/tree wouldnt help it too much.
The wiring would be each pickup is connected directly to the coresponding V/T, nothing too fancy. Ive never owned a guitar like that though, seems cool the way its set up.
If you want a fun project, take off the back and pack it full of stomp boxes  |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
Truss Rod Adjustment?
