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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
 Posted - 12/06/2008 : 14:05:20
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Hi All
this is an effect i want to introduce into my rig for some ambience on certain songs we do and i'm not entirely happy with the reverb from the Pod rack unit i use(just reverb everything else switched off)..i had played with runing a wet/dry/wet scenario but i can't really let go of my valve amps(using a solid state marshall combo on the last few gigs while waiting on parts for my old amps... ) so my question is really this....
i plan on using both my amps in stereo again so would a stereo reverb pedal like the RV-5(DeFrag wasn't a big fan)on the new digitech hardwire be the way to go or....
whats the difference with using something like a quadraverb just for reverb at the end of the chain before the amps(amps running clean,don't have any effects loops) with the pedalboard going in the front end of the processor..anyone using a rig in this way and if so whats the quality of the results.....?
basically i'm a bit wary of going down the solid state power amp route after using the marshall on the last couple of gigs and a valve pre and power amp is way beyond my means at the moment....quadraverb going for 80 euro at the moment locally been for sale for 2 months with no takers and he won't budge on the price..... ........ |
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Dr. Bob
Moderator
Australia
6593 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 14:27:03
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Hi Franzoni
I know this reply doesn't really answer your question/concerns but,
I believe Laurie has a Quadraverb, in his collection.
And can probably steer you in the right direction.
They have really fine sounding reverbs, considered very highly by a lot of users.
And when it comes to the POD & POD Pro, you must remember, that they,
are modeling some really old (vintage) bits of gear.
That might be one of the reasons you are somewhat dissatisfied with,
the reverbs, & some of the other effects in the POD's.
A lot of people fall for the misconception, that the POD is New, It's digital, It costs heaps, so therefore they must have really good effects.
When the reality is, they emulate/model REALLY OLD EFFECTS & Amps.
and that's where their initial focus has been.
And we all wanted & scream for vintage gear, not all vintage gear is good.
Regards Dr. Bob
PS What was the story with the Marshall?
quote:
basically i'm a bit wary of going down the solid state power amp route after using the marshall on the last couple of gigs
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Edited by - Dr. Bob on 12/06/2008 14:28:27 |
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zerksies
Double Platinum Member
USA
3406 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 15:13:10
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| i would say buy a fender amp with reverb you can't beat it. |
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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 15:18:34
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G'day Doc....
the marshall i used belongs to the Drummer it's a 100 watt solid state 1x12 combo... very harsh/trebley sounding at higher gig volumes no matter what way i tried to dial in the EQ...i think part of the problem is the SD twin tube and the output it produces,you need the bigger headroom of the marshall superbass or the musicman combo for it i think...solid state or smaller combos like my selmer can't cope with the volume it produces....i actually like the POD for recording and the routing options(switchable stereo effects loop) it gives me especially with the Dynacord rack unit and the delay/echo sims are very good..but i've been listening to a lot of Bill Frisell,Eric Johnson,James Wilsey,etc.... even one of my hereos Jeff Beck is using a lexicon reverb unit again for some stuff and i think i would like the ambience of some reverb..also i'm not using the CH-1 stereo chorus anymore since i got the CE-2,a stereo effect at the end of the chain would be handy for splitting the signal evenly between the two amps..... the sound i get from the Musicman and Marshall combined is very 'round' of as EVH described it 'Brown' and hopefully it will be all back on track soon.... i also had the idea of running one of the DD-3's in stereo and sending the dry side to the Musicman and try to fix the Musicmans built in spring reverb..i don't think it's the tank but one of the transistors the drives the unit.... need to figure this one out..... |
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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 15:26:08
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quote:
Originally posted by zerksies
i would say buy a fender amp with reverb you can't beat it.
That is another option i thought of but to be honest zerksies,the musicman is more or less the same as a twin reverb.. one option is to figure out what the prob is with it's internals on the reverb side.... and also to be honest a 70's silverface twin secondhand at the moment here are going for 800/1200 euro.....for a silver face twin...?? a bit out of my range plus i wouldn't pay it and the newer Fender stuff is astronomicial prices in the shops....i like the older stuff if possible,pre PCB or early PCB construction..easier for a person like me to work on.... |
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Dr. Bob
Moderator
Australia
6593 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 15:36:37
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Hi Franzoni
quote:
i also had the idea of running one of the DD-3's in stereo and sending the dry side to the Musicman and try to fix the Musicmans built in spring reverb..i don't think it's the tank but one of the transistors the drives the unit.... need to figure this one out.....
Sorry I don't live a bit closer, you would be welcome to bring your musical children over.
And the Kids & Mrs Franzoni too.  
Did you ever find schematics for these older Selmer & the Marshal Tube amps?
Yell out if you need me, Laurie or one of the other Tech guys here, to teach you how to measure transistors with you Multimeter.
Regards Dr. Bob |
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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 15:40:21
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Cheers.... i rewired the strat the other day and i managed to figure out to use a resisitor to lower the ohms on a 1 meg pot to use as a tone control for the bridge pickup...you guys are starting to rub off on me..... ...... |
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Dr. Bob
Moderator
Australia
6593 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 16:15:33
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quote:
Originally posted by FRANZONI
Cheers.... i rewired the strat the other day and i managed to figure out to use a resisitor to lower the ohms on a 1 meg pot to use as a tone control for the bridge pickup...you guys are starting to rub off on me...........
 
For any TWO resistor values, it's a simple formula:
I remember & teach this simply as:
Product over Sum
R1 x R2 divided by R1+R2
(works for any values)
(just don't forget about all the zeros if you are working in K's or Megs)
Say you had two resistors 100 and 470
R1 x R2
-------
R1 + R2
100x470
--------
100+470
47000
------
570
= 82.45 ohms or with rounding = 82.5 ohms or 82 ohms
If the resistors are the same value, then the answer is simply half the value.
Try a few values out for yourself.
Regards Dr. Bob |
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verivorax
Platinum Member
Canada
1185 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 16:26:29
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totally separate idea..
I don't have a reverb pedal yet (only the RV-2 will ever be in collection).. so when I run two amps, I just pump the reverb on the one which has a tank in it, and let the other (the Mesa Subway Rocket) play totally dry.. By that token, you could try to a washier reverb out of one amp only and see how it affects the tone from the audience position.. (OR, just apply reverb through the board?)
Another solution would be a home-made reverb tank.. I've wanted to build one for a while, but the project seems out of my skill level. I can get an used Accutronics tank pretty easily, but beyond that...  |
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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 20:29:50
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quote:
Originally posted by verivorax
totally separate idea..
I don't have a reverb pedal yet (only the RV-2 will ever be in collection).. so when I run two amps, I just pump the reverb on the one which has a tank in it, and let the other (the Mesa Subway Rocket) play totally dry.. By that token, you could try to a washier reverb out of one amp only and see how it affects the tone from the audience position.. (OR, just apply reverb through the board?)
Another solution would be a home-made reverb tank.. I've wanted to build one for a while, but the project seems out of my skill level. I can get an used Accutronics tank pretty easily, but beyond that...
that was an idea i had as well but the reverb on the musicman doesn't work..i don't think it's the tank but the transistor driving it...i can't claim it but joe bonamassa does this with his set up and he claims he 'borrowed' it from Eric Johnsons mid 80's setup..i.e delay into one dry amp and set the other one for reverb with no echo.... |
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nathanscribe
Silver Member
United Kingdom
376 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 21:20:51
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I don't have a Quadraverb, but I do have a Microverb IV (circa '96). It's 18-bit, and I expect the old Quads will be 12 (maybe 16 for later versions, you'd have to check). The MvIV has a dark, slightly rough sound - Quads will be more of the same, being older still. I'd make sure that's the kind of ambience you want. To my ears, my brief dabbling with an RV-2 produced even more pronounced grain to the sound than the Mv. The Quad does have more variety too.
Didn't they do a Quadraverb GT, geared to guitarists?
I reckon if it's cheap you should just try it. You can probably get your money back if you don't like it. |
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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2008 : 23:09:55
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| Sounds like a plan....... only prob i haven't sold anything on in years ...... but this will fit nicely in the rack and won't take up much space.....i might try to swing over tomorrow..keep you posted.... |
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visserman
Platinum Member
1072 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2008 : 16:58:08
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Hi Franz,
Your question is really diverse, and I think you know some of the answers already.
Would it not be possible to borrow of someone you know a RV2, 3 or 5, in that way you can check and see what you like.
I find the RV's beef up the sound a bit. I do use pedals infront of my amps, use my two small Marshalls, and with the pedals and the RV I get a fuller sound compared to using nothing at all, but heh, this is all common sense eh?
Not happy with my sound though, but I need to experiment more for that particular sound I need, as I play a lot of single notes at the moment, and that requires a somewhat different approach compared to playing chords. |
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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 11:55:59
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quote:
Originally posted by visserman
Hi Franz,
Your question is really diverse, and I think you know some of the answers already.
Hi Visserman... haven't heard from you in a while bro'........yep your right.... i think what i'm really aiming for is other peoples experiences with reverb especially playing live....last night i used the solid state marshall with the little valve selmer amp in stereo,i set the marshalls reverb to about 4 and the selmer doesn't have any but the valves warms the sound up for my ears ..i put my old CH-1 on the end of the board to feed the two amps and the CE-2 in the loop with the delay and tremolo... the two chorus pedals on together with a little delay sounded amazing,really full and warm sounding..the only thing is the marshall has a bit too much midrange in it for me especially on the clean stuff,my older superbass valve head isn't nowhere as midrangy sounding..... i had planned to split the end with a DD-3 and send the DD-3's dry signal to the amp with reverb but in the end i was pretty happy with the sound..i think i might pursue the musicmans built in reverb and try this etup out for a while..... now if i can only figure out how to get the Dynacord rack unit into this rig....?....... |
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Dirk
Platinum Member
Netherlands
1309 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 17:47:33
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| Hey Franzoni, can't you just use the Dynacord instead of the CH-1? Or at least at that spot? |
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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 12/08/2008 : 18:35:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Dirk
Hey Franzoni, can't you just use the Dynacord instead of the CH-1? Or at least at that spot?
i could but the dynacord affects even when bypassed by adding a bit of midrange to the sound thats why i keep it in the stereo effects loop of the pod i can switch it in and out as needed... i might just use the CE-2 and the CH-1 and if i need a leslie type sound just turn the CE-2 up full.....they used to make pedalboards that had a rack built in for 2 or 3 processors but they don't seem to be around anymore... then i could get one of those stereo lehle switchers that DeFrag is so fond of and run the whole thing stereo....if anyone has a CH-1(mine is analog) and a CE-2 and like a deep chorus sound try putting the CE-2 into the CH-1 and out to a couple of amps with a bit of delay or reverb.......speaking of reverb i found this on you tube..sounds pretty good.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vsxk1rJ4mWk ...... |
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Reverb questions......
