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neala
Bronze Member
United Kingdom
66 Posts |
 Posted - 01/15/2010 : 18:12:55
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Thanks Dirk
i have made my living as a proffessional guitar tech for over 20 years now with a long list of well known artists and it is always real breath of fresh air to hear somebody else say that about intonation. it is true that there is no such thing as the perfectly in tune guitar. It is also true that you can spend hours or even weeks setting the intonation on somebody else's guitar but the moment you give it to them because of a different playing style it will be different again. I think the secret with intonation is all about tolerences. |
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Radioheading
Silver Member
United Kingdom
494 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2010 : 18:14:20
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quote:
Originally posted by nosi0
I just posted this on the non-boss-gear section before i saw this, as this wasn't the section i would have check to see if somebody posted it already. heres another link:
http://www.sonicstate.com/amped/2010/01/15/wnamm10-the-most-revolutionary-product-of-namm-2010/
it says 85 euros as the price.
about the tuning issues its not the tuners thats the problem, its the frets. the position of the frets is nearly always wrong. the only way to get perfect notes all over your fretboard is to have a True Temperament system and i can assure you those are very hard to get used to. i tried one of my frieds for a while its just not natural to me.
Here, Vai using them weird frets  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b58Xil8RfRY I'd love a go. |
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nosi0
Gold Member
Netherlands
511 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2010 : 18:32:09
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| One of the two great players i know that have tried them the other is Mattias "IA" Eklundh. The guitar in the picture is his signature model(one of his signature models he also has them without TT frets) |
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Dirk
Platinum Member
Netherlands
1309 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2010 : 19:46:39
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quote:
Originally posted by aaronharmon
I completely disagree about it being "more art than science" though. I would say it is 100% science. A4 = 440 oscillations per second and has a wave length of 78.4 centimeters in western music.
Anything that doesn't have a root of Ao = 27.5 Hz (27.5, 55, 110, 220, 440, 880, etc) simply isn't A
A machine can do this better than a man any day of the week.
I totally agree with you on that ofcourse.
What I meant wasn't the tuning itself, but making your instrument sounds as if it's tuned in all keys, all position, yada yada...
Sometimes you have to bend a note a little for it to get in tune, or use some vibrato to make it sound right.
Plus all the outside factors, like moving instruments from the cold onto a hot stage, with hot stage lights, and making weird stage moves, playing behind your back, bending the neck, all kinds of stuff that will likely to put even the most expensive instrument out of tune, but you have to keep playing, cause the show must go on 
I can see how it sounded confusing, sorry about that.  |
Edited by - Dirk on 01/15/2010 19:52:50 |
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aaronharmon
Silver Member
USA
271 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2010 : 20:21:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Dirk
quote:
Originally posted by aaronharmon
I completely disagree about it being "more art than science" though. I would say it is 100% science. A4 = 440 oscillations per second and has a wave length of 78.4 centimeters in western music.
Anything that doesn't have a root of Ao = 27.5 Hz (27.5, 55, 110, 220, 440, 880, etc) simply isn't A
A machine can do this better than a man any day of the week.
I totally agree with you on that ofcourse.
What I meant wasn't the tuning itself, but making your instrument sounds as if it's tuned in all keys, all position, yada yada...
Sometimes you have to bend a note a little for it to get in tune, or use some vibrato to make it sound right.
Plus all the outside factors, like moving instruments from the cold onto a hot stage, with hot stage lights, and making weird stage moves, playing behind your back, bending the neck, all kinds of stuff that will likely to put even the most expensive instrument out of tune, but you have to keep playing, cause the show must go on
I can see how it sounded confusing, sorry about that.
No worries, I can totally see what your saying. We are just having a theoretical discourse.
I use jumbo or large frets on all my instruments and I sometimes practice fretting notes with a tuner because simply smashing the E string onto the fretboard at the 3rd fret does not make a proper G (in standard tuning). It will be a little sharp or a little flat depending on the amount of pressure that you apply. It's a little anal, I know, and I don't worry about it while I am playing. I just like to be aware of it.
The fact is that beyond the open position (assuming proper intonation) there are so many variables that you could never be perfect. The best we can do is set up the instrument properly and tune to the open position. This new PolyTune by TC appears to excel at that. The point of this thread was simply to point out that while the Pitch Black stole the TU-2's thunder (admittedly it's only recently), the TU-3 was marketed, I think, to recapture some of those lost sales. Now this device appears to put a beating on the TU-3 right out of the gate.
I have seen adds for those bizarre fretting systems before and maybe someone like Steve Vai can benefit from something like that. I would rather spend my time working on technique, etc than relearning the fretboard. |
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neala
Bronze Member
United Kingdom
66 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2010 : 20:47:03
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| Good grief. What on earth is that all about. Talk about trying to reinvent the wheel. I wonder whether Jimmy Page Eric Clapton or the Beatles wished they had one of those when they were recording thier greatest songs all those years ago. I would imagine that thats the sort of thing that would make Jimmy Hendrix turn in his grave, off course if he ever had time enough to bother taking an interest in something like that as I am sure he was a busy guy what with all that partying and gigging and actually living his life,although I do belive he had weekends off |
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FRANZONI
Double Platinum Member
Ireland
3543 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2010 : 21:27:20
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quote:
Originally posted by neala
Good grief. What on earth is that all about. Talk about trying to reinvent the wheel. I wonder whether Jimmy Page Eric Clapton or the Beatles wished they had one of those when they were recording thier greatest songs all those years ago. I would imagine that thats the sort of thing that would make Jimmy Hendrix turn in his grave, off course if he ever had time enough to bother taking an interest in something like that as I am sure he was a busy guy what with all that partying and gigging and actually living his life,although I do belive he had weekends off
+1....i don't think those guys would of worried too much about the latest tuner and all that stuff back in the day..... they probabably would of just tuned by ear with the bass player and probably got a root note to start off the keyboards/hammond if there were any..there seems to be some sort of fixation with tuners these days with a lot of players and about been perfectly in tune to the nth degree.... i say "near enough be dammed" as were making music here guys and gals not swiss watches......i have a TU-12 must be nearly 20 years and it's served me week in and out on gigs perfectly fine...plus ask eric johnson or jerry donahue about fine tuning to a particular instrument by ear as they would tell you that the G will still be 'out' in their reckoning after using a tuner.. both have their own method of getting the guitar the way they want it and EJ is notorious for having the ears of a bat when it comes to anything with the guitar....also thats why Buzz Feiten came up with the tempered tuning with the fret thing and yamaha started using on some of their artist signature guitar as someone else always pointed out with the pictures...so if your using a vintage style instrument it's always going to be a compromise as neala said from player to player.... |
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Dr. Bob
Moderator
Australia
6593 Posts |
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hateandwar
Gold Member
Australia
524 Posts |
Posted - 01/16/2010 : 03:48:41
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| TU-2 works good for me. Seems a bit pointless to me. I wish companies would make some sort of new effect instead of making new tuners...just my opinion |
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Dirk
Platinum Member
Netherlands
1309 Posts |
Posted - 01/16/2010 : 10:11:40
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quote:
Originally posted by neala
I would imagine that thats the sort of thing that would make Jimmy Hendrix turn in his grave.
Most of the time he was too high to notice he was out of tune anyway. |
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aaronharmon
Silver Member
USA
271 Posts |
Posted - 01/16/2010 : 12:24:44
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quote:
Originally posted by hateandwar
TU-2 works good for me. Seems a bit pointless to me. I wish companies would make some sort of new effect instead of making new tuners...just my opinion
Good point. |
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Iversen
Bronze Member
Denmark
111 Posts |
Posted - 01/16/2010 : 17:40:13
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I have a Turbo Tuner ST-200, a strobe tuner in an MXR-sized box. Nothing is gonna take me to the tuner market again.
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silvertone6120
Gold Member
USA
609 Posts |
Posted - 01/16/2010 : 18:04:56
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My tech would shit a brick if I came in his shop with that guitar saying "I need a refret"! |
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Erik dP
Silver Member
Sweden
150 Posts |
Posted - 01/22/2010 : 10:43:44
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A store i Sweden apparently ask for 1095sek ~ $150 US.
I don't work there so delete this link below if it is considered to be spam:
http://www.vend.se/ad.php?11241
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TU-3 further behind the powercurve already?
- Moderator.