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phostenix
Gold Member
USA
754 Posts |
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bossarea
Forum Admin
United Kingdom
3652 Posts |
 Posted - 11/24/2005 : 17:04:32
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I think 1985 pedals should have black labels.
The first Taiwan pedals surfaced late 86/Early 87. Up until this point I think the only label ever used was black. The first Taiwan pedals had black labels too but around 1987 labels in all sorts of colours appeared both on Japanese and Taiwanese pedals.
It would be interesting to compare label colours against 6 digit serial number. Regardless of the year of production we might find out at which serial number they started using coloured labels. |
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Sunburst
Silver Member
427 Posts |
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phostenix
Gold Member
USA
754 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2005 : 18:28:13
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Thanks guys. I have a CE-3, S/N 573400 that is Green Label MIJ. From what I've observed with the CH-1 & CE-5's, the label color changed whenever the verbage on the label changed.
E.G., my Green MIJ CE-3 has added a new line at the bottom that isn't on the Black Label MIJ:
"Complies with the limits for a Class B computing device pursuant to Subpart J of Part 15 of FCC Rules."
I always thought Subpart J was the best part of Part 15.... 
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Sunburst
Silver Member
427 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2005 : 18:53:18
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There seem to be some inconsistency to when the label colours changed. It appears for example, like both black and green labels were in use simultaneously.
My VB-2 for example has a serial starting with 2XXXXX and has a green label. So it seems that green labels might have appeared as early as 1982. I know for certain that my VB-2 is from 1982, as the manual for it was printed in 1982. |
Edited by - Sunburst on 11/24/2005 18:55:57 |
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bossarea
Forum Admin
United Kingdom
3652 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2005 : 20:51:25
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I've never seen a green label VB-2. Are you absolutely sure it's the original bottom plate? It could be but it very uncommon if it is. Does it have the reference to Subpart J? I'm not sure the FCC rules were written at that time.
I can't beleive I'm browsing FCC rules trying to find Part 15, subpart J  I know I got a screw loose but this time I've lost it completely 
I think they're here but I'm not sure http://wireless.fcc.gov/rules.html |
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Sunburst
Silver Member
427 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2005 : 22:15:27
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Yes, it has the reference to Subpart J.
My VB-2 is in mint condition and has hardly ever been used. The bottomplate is also extremely clean. I find it hard to believe it is not original, and since its in such a minty condition I wonder why the bottomplate would have been changed over the years. This pedal has spent most of its years in a closet and the bottomplate looks certainly as it is original to this unit. The description on this site on VB-2 also indicates that green labels were used.
I looked at my DM-3 which also has the same green label, and reference to subpart J. The serial on that one starts with a 4XXXXX, so presumably its from 1984, and it also most certainly has the original backplate.
However, my DS-1 MIJ with serial 5XXXXX has a black label, without the reference to subpart J. even though its probably a 1985 unit.
The important question here is when the FCC rules were written. I dont know that year.
quote:
Originally posted by bossarea
I've never seen a green label VB-2. Are you absolutely sure it's the original bottom plate? It could be but it very uncommon if it is. Does it have the reference to Subpart J? I'm not sure the FCC rules were written at that time.
I can't beleive I'm browsing FCC rules trying to find Part 15, subpart J I know I got a screw loose but this time I've lost it completely
I think they're here but I'm not sure http://wireless.fcc.gov/rules.html
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Edited by - Sunburst on 11/24/2005 22:17:22 |
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bossarea
Forum Admin
United Kingdom
3652 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2005 : 22:57:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Sunburst
The description on this site on VB-2 also indicates that green labels were used.
Ooops, didn't remember that. Looks like I must have seen at least one earlier then.  |
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Sunburst
Silver Member
427 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2005 : 23:19:04
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Well, at least it looks like the original backplate on the VB-2 when I have examined it really close but of course its important to know when the FCC rules part 15 Subpart J was written. When that is established we will know for sure about the backplates.
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bossarea
Forum Admin
United Kingdom
3652 Posts |
Posted - 11/24/2005 : 23:52:54
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It looks like it is from 1979 or 1980 so it could very well be on a pedal from 1982. See quote below.
The whole Part 15 is however about radio interference of digital devices so why use it on an analog pedal? Possibly because it's just a back plate and they used whatever they had laying around. I don't know.
quote:
http://www.conformity.com/0502/0502historical.html
The Commission accepted many of the recommendations and rationales provided by CBEMA for electronic equipment, and on September 19, 1979, adopted the First Report and Order � Technical Standards for Computing Equipment in FCC Docket No. 20780 [4]. The Rules were designed to control the interference potential by limited radiated and conducted RF emissions of many electronic products. Two sets of radiated and conducted limits were adopted along with some administrative requirements (e.g., approval methods, labeling, user information). A number of minor changes and a postponement of the effective date of the rules were made in an Order adopted on March 27, 1980 in response to a number of petitions for reconsideration [5]. The second Order also provided a number of exemptions, such as: home appliances, test equipment, supervised medical digital devices, electronic equipment in transportation vehicles and industrial equipment. Because of space limitations, the reader is directed to references 2-6 for a more detailed explanation of the background of the proceeding leading to the rules for digital devices.
The end result of this proceeding was the creation of an entirely new subpart to regulate digital devices�the FCC�s Part 15 Subpart J. In 1979, the FCC Part 15 Rules were extensively re-organized in Docket 87-389. The term �computing device� was replaced with the more general �digital device� [6]. In today�s Rules, the technical requirements for personal computers and other digital devices are contained in Part 15, Subpart B.
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phostenix
Gold Member
USA
754 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2005 : 05:41:02
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But remember, the BBD is driven by a clock pulse (actually, 2 clock pulses - a bi-phase clock pulse) from the MN3101 or MN3102 clock driver chip in pedals like the CE-2, CE-3, BF-2, VB-2, etc. Because the delay used on these pedals is small, the clock rate is in the mid to high range. I don't have the numbers off the top of my head, but I believe the clock is running at about 40KHz on these. I'll put a couple on the scope and post back. While that clock rate is considered slow by today's digital sampling rates, it still can produce noise transmission in a poorly designed or poorly shielded device. So, that part of the circuit could easily be considered a "digital" device. These FCC rules are intended to keep devices off the market that create noise interference for other devices.
Grace and peace,
Steve
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Sunburst
Silver Member
427 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2005 : 08:06:13
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Thanks for the info guys.
This would mean that the green backplate really is original then. It would be interesting to come across another VB-2 with the same green backplate and know its serialnumber. |
Edited by - Sunburst on 11/25/2005 08:06:59 |
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bossarea
Forum Admin
United Kingdom
3652 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2005 : 09:12:42
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Aaaah, you're right. I never considered the clock driver.
It still seems a bit random making new back plates and not using them consistently. |
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Sunburst
Silver Member
427 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2005 : 09:50:44
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| Well, the next mission we have now is hunting down the earliest known pedal that has the reference text to the FCC rules. It is interesting to know when it first appeared, and on which pedals... |
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Sunburst
Silver Member
427 Posts |
Posted - 11/25/2005 : 10:01:46
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| According to bossarea, it seems like green labels are rare on a VB-2 after all, but actually did appear. |
Edited by - Sunburst on 11/25/2005 10:05:35 |
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Topic |
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How to date a Boss pedal from its serial number?
